October 27, 2010 at 3:43 pm #3487goutguyParticipant
After 15+ years suffering with gout, I found out that simply cutting out chicken from my diet was the #1 big solution.??? Adding cherry juice from concentrate (and pills) helps too, and the bean broth was also good… but the best cure is prevention.
This is like a 95%+ correlation for me; when the wife makes chicken for the first time in a few weeks, I immediately get a gout attack within 12-18 hours.? Otherwise, I get virtually no gout attacks. Finally! I wish I'd known this 15 years ago; it was hard to find out food correlations.??
For what it's worth, beer and shellfish I’m fine with (I like heineken and clam chowder, can eat that a lot and no gout ever), and virtually everything else.? Chicken is the culprit, confirmed with multiple diet tests this past 18 months.?? Avoid chicken for a month+ and no gout… after I eat chicken, instant gout attack.? My doctor said to avoid turkey too, though I haven't had an attack after eating that.
Also in other news, I just started uloric low dose a month ago for the first time, will be going in to get tested to see if UA <6 w/blood test soon; too sensitive to AP, hives/chest pain on trying allopurinol, so trying uloric, though I'll be sure to have a liver panel done to see if uloric is having any detrimental effects on liver function (any other tests I should ask for?).
Gout's a pain, the main concerns are joint damage, kidney damage and internal tophi plus heart/diabetes concerns, so getting UA < 6 is key.? Hey anyone have any recommendations for one of those testers, to buy in the USA?? So far I've only seen UA testers from overseas suppliers.? My genetic stock is Irish/German fwiw. Thanks for listening.? Cut out chicken for a month and see what I'm talking about.?? Hope it helps!? And the cherry juice concentrates on amazon are good too to use, better than cherry pills.
-kOctober 27, 2010 at 3:43 pm #3441vlad115Participant
I have been reading this forum for few months now and this is my first post. Please excuse me for it being not so short one but I think my successful Munich's Octoberfest experience (albeit with quite a bit of preparation) might be encouraging for fellow gout sufferers. So here is the essay:)
I have been a gout sufferer for about 5 years and was able to go to Munich's Oktoberfest this year and have a time of my life without limiting myself in beer drinking and NOT having an attack. It took quite a bit of research and preparation but over a course of 5 days I was able to drink:
– 6 liters during the first day,
– 3 and a half – the second,
– about 2,5 the fourth (skipped 3rd altogether) and,
– about 3,5 liters during 5th and last day
without even getting twinges and tingles.
I'm a 36 year old male and have had gout attacks here and there since I was 31. I have been heavy social drinker for most of my adult life (I strongly believe that social drinking gets people closer together) with really heavy meat diet (until about I was 33). I quit smoking when I was 30 and that started my love for beer. I guess the body needed to replace one bad thing with another. I did have quite a few beers before that but I never really liked it. As for exercise I have been playing soccer for all my life (about once-twice a week) and have been doing occasional running here and there.
I was diagnosed with gout when I was 34. I tore Achilles tendon back then followed by reconstructive surgery and couple of weeks into recovery I had left toe pain and thought that it is due to that injury. The pain was pretty intense so I went to see my doctor and voila – gout! I then started reading about it and analyzing my past foot pains and came to a conclusion that I had first attack in my right ankle when I was 31. It happened on Tuesday after 3 days of weekend night drinking and overeating ended on Sunday. After that one I did have a few attacks (about once a year) coming on Tuesday and Wednesday nights about a day or two after weekend festivities.
Back to post-injury attacks (2 years ago) – I believe I had one directly beer-related attack when I had probably 3 or 4 liters over course of 6 hours. I was still on crutches and injured foot got hit with a flare. The attack happened in the morning (or probably at night but I was too drunk to realize it).
At that time I decided that I need to do something about the damn thing – I started taking cherry concentrate pills (http://www.gnc.com/product/ind…..Id=2133248) – 2 pills each morning. I also went to see chinese herbal doctor, which promised to cure the thing over course of a year. He said that fluids circulation would increase and that would fix the problem. It didn't. At the time Uric Acid level was measured and it was around 8.1.
Here I have to say that I'm a russian orthodox and do 4 lents a year. The longest one is 48 days. During that time I don't drink alcohol and go vegan. This spring I decided to measure Uric Acid before and after lent. Before: 8.2 after: 6.3. In a month though it went back to 8.3. During that month I was pretty liberal in alcohol, meats and seafood. I started getting twinges and tingles. I was doing very little excercise and had a lot of stress at work and in general being a father of 7 and 2 year olds.
But back to the point – this spring during lent I made a decision to go to Munich Oktoberfest with my wife while I'm still young and gout is manageable. I purchased tickets and booked accommodations in March. At the time I didn't read web much and was not scared of beer as much as I was a month prior to a trip when I really got into gout readings.
I did try to steer away from meats and seafood for most of last half year (but not July-August as described below), but I still would have it 4-5 times a week (vs. 3 times a day like a few years ago). I went to Bulgaria for a 2 week vacation this summer and didn't have much meat but had a couple of beers every day (that would be one liter as bottles are 0.5l over there). But it must have been lack of stress and I didn't feel anything and my feet not even a twinge (I did have a few before a trip).
Preparation (August 10 – September 16th) and Oktoberfest (Sept. 17-22):
In July and early August I was drinking as my usual self – a lot on weekends (mostly hard staff) and ate meat 1-2 times daily. As a result I started getting twinges and tingles. Then in early August I ate one can of sardines and immediately got an attack. This is when I went into full-scale web searching and in awe realized that gout and beer don't go together at all. But I had to go to Oktoberfest and had to drink there as otherwise it would be a waste of time (I hate to be just a spectator) and a trip of my life would be just about ruined.
So I decided to do maximum I could to get myself ready and avoid a gout attack. The trip was scheduled for September 16th. Here is what I did prior to the trip:
– I started working out 4-5 times a week around August 10th. I don't want to go into full detail of a workout but it is about 35 minutes worth of push-ups, sit-downs and jump-rope mixed in with stretching. I did lose about 5-6 pounds although I had been maintaining relatively good weight prior to that (I have been overweight almost all my life, a lot of it due to my genes).
– There was a russian orthodox lent running from August 13-28, so I went vegan during that time. I had an opportunity to measure uric acid right after that and it was 6.6.
– I increased intake of black cherry concentrate pills from 2 in the morning adding 2 in the evening.
– I started taking Celery Seeds concentrate pills (http://www.bodybuilding.com/st…..tract.html) – one in the morning and one before bed
– At work I tried to drink a lot of water (around a gallon during workday). I work in an office so I have an ability to do that.
– I took German class (I'm sure that this is what helped me to avoid an attack as it made the trip so much more fun!!!)
During the Fest I also:
– had a half of teaspoon of baking soda mixed with water in the morning and in the evening (I failed one or two evenings due to high beer mileage :))
– used alkaline drops (http://www.amazon.com/Alkaline…..amp;sr=8-1) with pretty much every beer. I read that beer is very acidic and high acidity decreases body's ability to dissolve uric acid. I tried to find moments to put drops in so that people don't see it but not always succeeded, so my wife looked at me funny at times (I mentioned to her that I have gout a couple of years ago but didn't tell her all the “nice” permutations of the disease), so I had to tell her that it is for the overall health 🙂
– I didn't eat much meat during the Fest. We had a half-chicken for 2 of us for dinner and the rest of the day I tried to avoid it.
I also had a “test run” prior to Oktoberfest (in early September after lent) where I had about 3 liters of beer with friends over course of few hours. I did put alkaline drops in (I was successful at hiding that at the time).
Oktoberfest is a great holiday! I totally loved it and so did my wife! I thought it would be a once-in-a-lifetime experience but I now consider going back. Since we returned about a month ago we have visited a couple of local San Francisco fests, which also included some beer drinking (1-2 liters at most). I used alkaline drops all the time. Finally I got to a point where I did start to feel twinges, so I'm having an occasional baking soda. I'm winding that beer process down now as it is time to give body a break. Latest measurement of uric acid was 7.4.
At the end I'm not sure which of the measures helped but I got the result I wanted, which can hopefully encourage other people!
VladOctober 28, 2010 at 7:56 am #10487zip2playParticipant
You make me want to book a flight to Munich next Fall.
It seems you are in the oipening salvo stages of gout…and it is encouraging that you can get a 6.3 SUA. But a no alcohol, vegan diet is tough even oif they exted Lent to a year round event. (My grandparents were Russian Orthodox and they did the same single Lent as other Catholics…40 days before Easter??? Why the other 3?)
As you moght have guessed I'm very fond of allopurinol and suffice to say it is there when and if you need it. Remember, gout doesn't go away…it only gets worse. It was after my fifth attack over a couple years that I started, but that last attack was one that Jupiter could not have hurled with his mightiest lightning bolt.
I must say, that 6 liters is impressive (17 cans) for a single day. Although at a picnic in the hot Sun and baseball etc. I put away a case oif 24…and drove home 20 miles, but then American beers are weaker than Bavarian brews. Thank GOD we get smarter as we age.October 28, 2010 at 12:32 pm #10490vlad115Participant
It is kind of ironic but at this stage of the game gout is doing a sort of a good thing for me as it gave me motivation to excercise, which I currently do 3-4 times a week (just ran 3 miles yesterday) and I'm trying to watch what I eat. I do drink a little bit less, too, but still quite a bit on occasion, which happens every week or two. As far as antigout prevention after Oktoberfest I keep doing the following:
– take 2 black cherry pills in the morning and at night.
– take 1 celery seed in the morning and at night.
– drink a glass of milk every morning (somewhere on the web I dug out info that a glass of milk per day can decrease uric level by 0.5 over a course of a few months)
My San Francisco doctor tried to put me on allopurinol once he saw 7.4 measurement a couple of weeks ago. It is funny but different doctors are having different ranges. This particular one has 7.2 as the upper limit but my primary one has 8.2. Go figure. I know though that for myself 8.2 are twinges and tingles at the least. 7.4 seems to be OK. When I asked him about sideeffects he said that it is not good for kidneys, so I'm keeping that medicine on the backburner for now but I have a feeling that I'll get to it eventually.
What is your Uric Acid levels?
One more not about Oktoberfest – I usually can't wait for trips to happen but that time I was kind of dreading it as I knew I would not be able not to drink beer there and hence an attack (especially after so much bad beer/gout reading on the web). So when I woke up after 6-liter day with no gout whatsoever I was the happiest man on Earth 🙂
6-liter is by far my record 🙂 Previous one might have been 4 and I did drink a 2-liter boot 3-4 years ago in 20 minutes just because I was thirsty when we went to german-austrian place here in San Francisco (when people started clapping around, at first I did not know they were watching me:)). But no more 2-liter boots in 20 minutes (maybe in an hour or so with alkaline drops :))
24 cans is really impressive, though!
Being a russian vodka is still a primary drink for me. 900 gramms or so is the record there 🙂 Incidentally I heard my friend (he is a doctor) saying that vodka is the least of 40%-alcohol-containing gout evils out there.
In any case the reason for this post was that I could not find almost any encouraging beer/gout article on the web.
As far as Orthodox (not just Russian) lent goes it is 48 days, 8 extra days being:
Lazarus Saturday, 1 day
Entry of the Lord into Jerusalem, 1 day
Passion Week, 6 days
It is not easy for me to get through those 48 days but it makes me to switch into a bit different life mode (being born and raised in Soviet Union I'm not very religious, I do it mostly for health reasons), when I don't have to worry/plan for hangovers and not afraid of overeating. Actually after 2-3 weeks I start feeling more energy.January 16, 2011 at 5:09 pm #10913toofastParticipant
I think it is different for everyone…but it really?depends on HOW high was your UA when cutting out chicken worked.
My UA was almost 10, and nothing worked, from black bean broth to cherry juice, to everything else.
I can't believe that if your UA is super high, simply cutting out chicken works.? Oh, I did not eat any meat for almost a year, and my UA was still hoverin around 10.? So at least for me, it did not work.
Glad it worked for you though…seems everybody reacts differently.January 18, 2011 at 1:15 am #10926Keith Taylor (GoutPal Admin)Participant
Wise words toofast.
The last thing a gout suffererer needs is superstions about chicken (or any other single foodstuff).February 12, 2011 at 4:17 am #11117jeffParticipant
chicken has slowly developed as one of my gout triggers.
My last gout episode (for 3 months and on) started when i bought 1 kg of niblets. I cooked the whole lot and everyday for lunch and dinner i was having 3 to 4 pieces. Within days i started getting an attack.
I also know it is chicken because when i usually eat it pain develops slowly over a few days.June 30, 2016 at 12:51 am #22534GoutPal HelpDeskParticipant
Another mention from @goutguy re: “trying uloric, though I’ll be sure to have a liver panel done to see if Uloric is having any detrimental effects on liver function”
So, another reminder from me about Improving Uloric Liver Warnings Guidelines for Gout Patients.
I know most people come here to read about Heineken & Gout. You can still discuss gout, Heineken, or any other drink in the beer forum.
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